Thursday, May 13, 2010
Power Disc Brakes: first (long) drive
Drove the Mustang to work today which is about 50 miles. Got stuck in the usual traffic and the brakes were absolutely amazing. My estimate is that it stops in about 1/3rd of the distance that it did before.
Wednesday, May 12, 2010
Power Disc Brake Conversion Install "Issues"
I completely forgot to post the tough parts of the installation. What makes matters worse is that in the midst of me uploading the pictures of the tough parts of the install I had an iPhoto crash which deleted the pics off the iPhone and ate them. Lame.
The overall name of the game was not enough clearance. You have such a limited space to work in between the shock tower, firewall, and in my case headers+valve cover bolts that are large wing nuts. In addition I run an export brace on top of the original shock tower->firewall ties which serves both as a tool shelf and an annoyance.
Tools:
- The bolt-head size of just about everything is 9/16" -- which is a departure from the ``normal" 1/2 inch-everything on the car. For awhile there I thought I had a GM! (not).
- The bleeder screws on the new calipers are 3/8".
- You might need a mechanic's mirror (see below) if you're doing a power conversion like I am.
- You'll need a 10mm flare wrench for the flare fittings.
- I had to use my alligator-style vice grip for a few portions of the install
- I had to use a blow torch on the distribution block to separate the rear line from the block. Plan on using one if your flare fittings here or down in the wheel wells have not been moved in many years.
Working in this area of the engine compartment proved to be difficult for me because having the car on jack stands+my height and arm length required a combination of standing on toes + a small step stool + getting frustrated at points and climbing up on the fender to reach down (which is never comfortable).
The booster proved to be the most strenuous part of the installation. The booster-to-firewall bracket is in two sections and with the exception of a 1/4" drive socket nothing fits around the kit-provided bolts but an open-ended wrench.
I had to detach the booster from the master cylinder (to bench bleed anyway), and separate the booster from its firewall brackets to bolt it up.
The top firewall side bolt hole in each bracket is conveniently parallel with the hole to attach the booster to the bracket, so I was able to use a 1/4" ratchet + extension through the other hole to attach the top bolts. The easiest method for attaching the bottom bolts I found (and this is especially true for the inner bracket -- the one furthest away from you when you're standing over the fender) is to start with them horizontal so you can actually SEE and REACH the bolt until its almost tight then swing it into position and finish tightening it down. Again, on the bottom bolt NOTHING in my tool cache fit except an open ended wrench. Even then, due to clearance my Craftsman Cross-force (long) open ended wrench was too long to get good leverage, my standard open ended wrench was a bit too long too. I have a set of open-ended Husky wrenches that have a flexible ratchet closed end on the bottom that I eventually got to work. It's possible a short offset wrench would have worked but this was Mother's Day and I was too filthy to go in search of one.
Once the booster-to-firewall bracket was installed, it was time to mount up the booster. Getting the right combination of a tool that would fit + reaching around to access it was tough. Although I was able to reach all 4 stand-off threads with my hand, a wrench isn't so flexible. I ended up using my mechanics mirror for the inner-bottom nut so I could see it while I fished the wrench around it. The outer one was even more challenging because it's so close to the fender wall. Patience is a virtue bolting up the booster.
Bolting the master cylinder to the booster was easy and it went in without issue. HOWEVER, when I later tried to remove the master cylinder (with the lines hooked up) to check the push rod clearance et al -- this proved to be tough. With the lines connected there just isn't enough room to move the master cylinder as much as you could with them disconnected. I imagine if you're not doing power discs none of this will be an issue.
I walked the entire length of all my steel lines with my hands as best as I could and found them to be in excellent shape. There weren't any signs of rust, cracking, stress, corrosion, etc. I did not replace my hard lines during this exercise, but might opt to change them out entirely in the near future when I do my fuel lines or go with rear discs.
Other random things:
- A couple of my hard-line flare nuts were slightly rounded. For these I had to use the alligator-style vice grips to get a hold of
- If a 10mm flare wrench isn't obtainable a 10mm open ended wrench also works just be careful. It's very easy to round off these fittings.
- I found it particularly useful to disconnect the two wiring harnesses to the left and right of the master cylinder/brake booster area on the firewall. DEFINITELY disconnect and cover the one at the left most position on the firewall if you have to torch the distribution block to remove the rear brake line or you'll melt it.
- As I stated above plan on torching any flare fitting that hasn't moved in several years. In my case I have reasonable belief that the fittings at the distribution block had never moved except to be assembled in San Jose back in 1965. When I replaced the rubber front hoses previously on the car I played games with penetrating oil and WD-40 for 2-3 days before going to blow torch. This time I just went to blow torch and had the rear line flare nut moving in the distribution block in under 10 minutes. If you are using WD-40 or another penetrating oil on it prior to the torch make sure you wipe it down -- WD-40 is a flammable liquid after all.
- The L brackets provided with the kit to mount the front rubber hose-to-hard-line connections were a bit too short to reach my hard lines so I re-used my existing brackets.
- If you're doing the OEM style swap like me and you are not replacing any hard lines due to damage or wear then the only hard line you need to add is one from the master cylinder to the proportioning valve. For this, the local kragen/o'reilly has lengths of pre-made line waiting for you in lengths of 12" and up. I took the proportioning valve with me+ the adapter that went into the master cylinder (the master cylinder has a 3/8" port in front and a 7/16" in the rear. An adapter is provided for your convenience for the rear port). I made sure the appropriate 3/16" diameter tubing + flare nuts fit. It was a good thing too because the first one I picked up was tagged as the right one I needed but the flare nuts didn't thread onto the prop valve nor the adapter. Do you expect anything less from the local discount auto parts store? I don't.
- The proportioning valve with its residual pressure adapter on the back is rather long. Since I wasn't excited about bending the steel lines into an almost 90 degree bend right before the flare fitting I mounted it in a different place than I think the stock one is mounted. I punched two holes in the fender apron and threaded two screws + washers + locking washers through and that was that. I found it easy to not tighten the mounting screws down all the way against the fender apron until the lines were connected up for ease of lining up the flare fittings. There are images in the previous that show where I mounted it.
- When mounting the adjustable push rod sleeve under the dash to attach the brake pedal to the booster, you might need to use your alligator style vice grip again to LIGHTLY hold the threads coming out of the booster because the sleeve is stubborn in some spots threading it on. If I had to do it again I'd thread a second nut on there to hold onto while I adjusted the sleeve. I still might do this as I'm going to lower the pedal a little more. I'm not excited about this. Working under the dash sucks.
The overall name of the game was not enough clearance. You have such a limited space to work in between the shock tower, firewall, and in my case headers+valve cover bolts that are large wing nuts. In addition I run an export brace on top of the original shock tower->firewall ties which serves both as a tool shelf and an annoyance.
Tools:
- The bolt-head size of just about everything is 9/16" -- which is a departure from the ``normal" 1/2 inch-everything on the car. For awhile there I thought I had a GM! (not).
- The bleeder screws on the new calipers are 3/8".
- You might need a mechanic's mirror (see below) if you're doing a power conversion like I am.
- You'll need a 10mm flare wrench for the flare fittings.
- I had to use my alligator-style vice grip for a few portions of the install
- I had to use a blow torch on the distribution block to separate the rear line from the block. Plan on using one if your flare fittings here or down in the wheel wells have not been moved in many years.
Working in this area of the engine compartment proved to be difficult for me because having the car on jack stands+my height and arm length required a combination of standing on toes + a small step stool + getting frustrated at points and climbing up on the fender to reach down (which is never comfortable).
The booster proved to be the most strenuous part of the installation. The booster-to-firewall bracket is in two sections and with the exception of a 1/4" drive socket nothing fits around the kit-provided bolts but an open-ended wrench.
I had to detach the booster from the master cylinder (to bench bleed anyway), and separate the booster from its firewall brackets to bolt it up.
The top firewall side bolt hole in each bracket is conveniently parallel with the hole to attach the booster to the bracket, so I was able to use a 1/4" ratchet + extension through the other hole to attach the top bolts. The easiest method for attaching the bottom bolts I found (and this is especially true for the inner bracket -- the one furthest away from you when you're standing over the fender) is to start with them horizontal so you can actually SEE and REACH the bolt until its almost tight then swing it into position and finish tightening it down. Again, on the bottom bolt NOTHING in my tool cache fit except an open ended wrench. Even then, due to clearance my Craftsman Cross-force (long) open ended wrench was too long to get good leverage, my standard open ended wrench was a bit too long too. I have a set of open-ended Husky wrenches that have a flexible ratchet closed end on the bottom that I eventually got to work. It's possible a short offset wrench would have worked but this was Mother's Day and I was too filthy to go in search of one.
Once the booster-to-firewall bracket was installed, it was time to mount up the booster. Getting the right combination of a tool that would fit + reaching around to access it was tough. Although I was able to reach all 4 stand-off threads with my hand, a wrench isn't so flexible. I ended up using my mechanics mirror for the inner-bottom nut so I could see it while I fished the wrench around it. The outer one was even more challenging because it's so close to the fender wall. Patience is a virtue bolting up the booster.
Bolting the master cylinder to the booster was easy and it went in without issue. HOWEVER, when I later tried to remove the master cylinder (with the lines hooked up) to check the push rod clearance et al -- this proved to be tough. With the lines connected there just isn't enough room to move the master cylinder as much as you could with them disconnected. I imagine if you're not doing power discs none of this will be an issue.
I walked the entire length of all my steel lines with my hands as best as I could and found them to be in excellent shape. There weren't any signs of rust, cracking, stress, corrosion, etc. I did not replace my hard lines during this exercise, but might opt to change them out entirely in the near future when I do my fuel lines or go with rear discs.
Other random things:
- A couple of my hard-line flare nuts were slightly rounded. For these I had to use the alligator-style vice grips to get a hold of
- If a 10mm flare wrench isn't obtainable a 10mm open ended wrench also works just be careful. It's very easy to round off these fittings.
- I found it particularly useful to disconnect the two wiring harnesses to the left and right of the master cylinder/brake booster area on the firewall. DEFINITELY disconnect and cover the one at the left most position on the firewall if you have to torch the distribution block to remove the rear brake line or you'll melt it.
- As I stated above plan on torching any flare fitting that hasn't moved in several years. In my case I have reasonable belief that the fittings at the distribution block had never moved except to be assembled in San Jose back in 1965. When I replaced the rubber front hoses previously on the car I played games with penetrating oil and WD-40 for 2-3 days before going to blow torch. This time I just went to blow torch and had the rear line flare nut moving in the distribution block in under 10 minutes. If you are using WD-40 or another penetrating oil on it prior to the torch make sure you wipe it down -- WD-40 is a flammable liquid after all.
- The L brackets provided with the kit to mount the front rubber hose-to-hard-line connections were a bit too short to reach my hard lines so I re-used my existing brackets.
- If you're doing the OEM style swap like me and you are not replacing any hard lines due to damage or wear then the only hard line you need to add is one from the master cylinder to the proportioning valve. For this, the local kragen/o'reilly has lengths of pre-made line waiting for you in lengths of 12" and up. I took the proportioning valve with me+ the adapter that went into the master cylinder (the master cylinder has a 3/8" port in front and a 7/16" in the rear. An adapter is provided for your convenience for the rear port). I made sure the appropriate 3/16" diameter tubing + flare nuts fit. It was a good thing too because the first one I picked up was tagged as the right one I needed but the flare nuts didn't thread onto the prop valve nor the adapter. Do you expect anything less from the local discount auto parts store? I don't.
- The proportioning valve with its residual pressure adapter on the back is rather long. Since I wasn't excited about bending the steel lines into an almost 90 degree bend right before the flare fitting I mounted it in a different place than I think the stock one is mounted. I punched two holes in the fender apron and threaded two screws + washers + locking washers through and that was that. I found it easy to not tighten the mounting screws down all the way against the fender apron until the lines were connected up for ease of lining up the flare fittings. There are images in the previous that show where I mounted it.
- When mounting the adjustable push rod sleeve under the dash to attach the brake pedal to the booster, you might need to use your alligator style vice grip again to LIGHTLY hold the threads coming out of the booster because the sleeve is stubborn in some spots threading it on. If I had to do it again I'd thread a second nut on there to hold onto while I adjusted the sleeve. I still might do this as I'm going to lower the pedal a little more. I'm not excited about this. Working under the dash sucks.
Tuesday, May 11, 2010
Power Disc Brake Conversion Wrap Up
The assembly portion was finished Sunday night -- but not without a few glitches:
1. My flare fitting to the master cylinder from the distribution block for front brakes wasn't seated all the way -- so when I bled the brakes I had leaking coming from there.
2. The lines were reversed. I guess I read "front brakes front port, rear brakes rear port" in my head when I reviewed the CSRP instructions (more on this in a minute). I got a solid bleed at some point but there was still a lot of travel in the pedal. After examining everything I realized that I had the bigger of the two reservoirs in the master cylinder plumbed to the rear brakes (though it was very clear in my mind that the discs need more pressure, hence more fluid et al). I swapped these and called it a night last night. I made a mess of myself, the tarp and any painted tools lying in the way of bleeding brake fluid. All the while during all of this when the engine was running I still had very, very light pedal action.
3. Re-bled this afternoon and I seemed to have a pretty firm pedal with the engine off. Fire up the engine and I had the light pedal again. After reviewing everything I've come to the conclusion that the booster works just -that well-. I've inquired to CSRP about limiting the amount of assist it gives.
4. Road test. Broke in the pads per the instructions and then went to work adjusting the proportioning valve. I probably need a few more tweaks on the valve for all conditions but as far I can tell I'm getting the desired front-then-rear lockup effect.
Here are some pictures of the newly installed booster + master cylinder + proportioning valve (you can see the black knob on the valve - installed below)
I have some fine tuning of the pedal height to do, but so far so good on the road test this evening. Braking is MUCH improved over before.
1. My flare fitting to the master cylinder from the distribution block for front brakes wasn't seated all the way -- so when I bled the brakes I had leaking coming from there.
2. The lines were reversed. I guess I read "front brakes front port, rear brakes rear port" in my head when I reviewed the CSRP instructions (more on this in a minute). I got a solid bleed at some point but there was still a lot of travel in the pedal. After examining everything I realized that I had the bigger of the two reservoirs in the master cylinder plumbed to the rear brakes (though it was very clear in my mind that the discs need more pressure, hence more fluid et al). I swapped these and called it a night last night. I made a mess of myself, the tarp and any painted tools lying in the way of bleeding brake fluid. All the while during all of this when the engine was running I still had very, very light pedal action.
3. Re-bled this afternoon and I seemed to have a pretty firm pedal with the engine off. Fire up the engine and I had the light pedal again. After reviewing everything I've come to the conclusion that the booster works just -that well-. I've inquired to CSRP about limiting the amount of assist it gives.
4. Road test. Broke in the pads per the instructions and then went to work adjusting the proportioning valve. I probably need a few more tweaks on the valve for all conditions but as far I can tell I'm getting the desired front-then-rear lockup effect.
Here are some pictures of the newly installed booster + master cylinder + proportioning valve (you can see the black knob on the valve - installed below)
I have some fine tuning of the pedal height to do, but so far so good on the road test this evening. Braking is MUCH improved over before.
Sunday, May 9, 2010
Power Front Disc Brake Conversion Days 1-2
I have lots to say, but will do it in the morning. The assembly is complete and all that's left to do is bleed/check for leaks, put the wheels on, adjust the proportioning valve and break-in the brakes per the instructions.
Friday, May 7, 2010
Power Front Disc Brake Conversion Day 0.5
In case you haven't figured it out yet -- I treated the car to a disc brake conversion kit (albeit about 3 weeks early) for its grand 45th birthday. I purchased the "OEM style" kit from Classic Services Restoration Parts (CSRP), http://www.discbrakeswap.com/ the gentleman who (I presume) owns and operates the business is very friendly and super knowledgeable. I was torn between the Granada swap and the OEM swap because he offered both for the same price. I chose the OEM swap for the following reasons:
1. Granada swaps aren't as cheap as they once were by sourcing the parts from a junk yard. CSRP offered both the OEM style and the granada-swap style for the same price. I *really* wanted a kit from CSRP (versus, say, Stainless Steel Brake Corp) but the prices were identical so no win there.
2. I'd have to remove and swap the spindles. This means another alignment -- but no big deal. I got a lifetime alignment with Firestone. CSRP also asserted that their Granada tie rods do NOT have the bump steer characteristics found in the usual Granada tie rods. This is not a big deal, however, because Mustang Steve sells adapter rings that'll allow you to use the standard Mustang tie rods with the Granada spindles. Which brings me to #3:
3. I just put brand new tires on the car out of necessity. Although my 14" wheels are of the disc-brake-compatible variety, I know for a fact they wouldn't have fit over the Granada rotors.
4. It used to be that the disc brake parts for the old Mustang setup were more expensive than their Granada counterparts. The pads for a Granada are twice that of the original Mustang calipers, when comparing semi-metallic or ceramic pads from the same vendor (Raybestos).
The CSRP kit is a modernization of the disc brakes offered as a factory option on the 65-66 Mustang. The calipers are still 4 piston, and the crossovers are still external -- but the design has been updated and the metal treated with an anti-corrosion surface (which was a huge problem with the factory brakes years ago).
Now onto the project! I started taking everything apart, and FedEx showed up with the kit around 7:00P. At that point I was well involved with removing the right/passenger side drum setup. All told I spent about 3.5 hours today working on it.
The first thing I did was lay a tarp down (hey, this house is a rental).
Threw the car up on jack stands then removed the right/passenger side wheel
Here's what we have now: drum brakes at all four wheels and a single reservoir power boosted master cylinder (pictures in the morning). At the end of this exercise we will still have power brakes -- but discs in the front and drums in the back. To accomplish this we'll need (obviously) disc brakes, a new dual reservoir master cylinder, and a power brake booster. Unfortunately Ford never intended/designed the 65-66 Mustangs, Comets, and Falcons to have the safety-mandated (as of the 1967 model year) dual reservoir master cylinder AND power brakes (yes, even the factory power disc brakes offered on A/K code and Shelby Mustangs of 1965-66 had a single reservoir master cylinder + power booster). No problem just bolt a dual reservoir master cylinder onto your existing brake booster right? Not so fast.
In order to compensate for the clutch linkage on cars with power brakes and a manual transmission, the factory installed and designed bracket positions the brake booster about 3 inches off the firewall (pictures in the morning). Because of this, there isn't adequate space to keep the factory booster setup + a brand new safety-minded dual reservoir master cylinder. With my kit comes a booster + master cylinder + bracket setup that solves all of this. Since I have an automatic transmission its a bolt-in setup. If I had a manual, however, I'd have to convert to a cable-clutch or hydraulic clutch operated transmission. Mental note for the future if I decide to throw the T-5 transmission in.
Starting with the passenger/right side, first we knock the grease cap off:
Pull the cotter pin and retainer/castle nut off, then get the big 1 1/8" wrench to get the spindle nut:
From there (though no images), you reach around and locate the 4 bolts that hold the drum assembly to the spindle. These require a tool of your choice in the 9/16" flavor. I opted for the 1/2" ratchet fitted with the 9/16" socket. The fourth nut (if you are facing the drum, the lower left) is tougher to get to due to the steering stop on top of the strut rod mount. For this I used the ratcheting box wrench. This nut is also further away than the other, which we'll get to later when assembling the disc parts. You'll also note I have not taken apart the drum assembly. I figured I'd cut the rubber brake hose and not have to deal with the star nut, wheel cylinder mounting nuts, et al. One of my least favorite assemblies on the car.
Above is the removed drum assembly + severed rubber brake hose.
Now to separate the rubber brake hose from the hard line affixed to the car. I always remove the bracket first, only to have to go back and re-attach it to get any kind of leverage on the hard line/rubber hose fitting. Some things you just never learn. Mine had been semi rounded out by a previous owner a bit, so I had to use the ol' vice grips to hold it.
Above is the bare spindle with the old grease removed/cleaned up.
First the new backing plate goes on the spindle, followed by the dust shield. It is attached with 4 bolts and torqued down to ~ 45ft/lbs. Note there are three short and one long bolt. The long bolt goes in that lower left hole that's considerably deeper than the other three. The backing plate also is where the caliper will bolt to.
The bolted up bracket + shield (above).
The kit comes with two shields that look virtually identical. The cutout in the shield must face the 3-o-clock position on the right side and the 9-o-clock position on the left side. If your shield is in the 3-o-clock position on the right side but isn't resting flat against the backing plate, you've got the wrong shield. Use the other one.
From there you perform the standard-duty front wheel bearing service. Yes Virginia, get out the bearings and filth them and yourself up with grease. Also grease up the hub. Much like a drum assembly there is an inner and outer bearing -- and the kit comes with the races already pressed in. No visit to Walt at the machine shop for this project! The pre-loading and torque down procedures are also similar to how the drums were done. You tighten the spindle nut to 10-15 ft/lbs -- which is a bit more than the drum torque specs IIRC.
From there I bolted on the caliper (with anti-sieze compound coating the threads -- provided with the kit!) and wrestled the grease cap in place. Following that I attached the crossover. Here's the "done" right/passenger side disc assembly, sans the hydraulic brake line behind it:
From there I removed the master cylinder and power booster with much WD-40 and a bit of heat to the brake line flare fittings. I was pretty filthy at that point so I didn't bother to snap pictures. I'll make up for it tomorrow.
Wednesday, May 5, 2010
Looks good enough to install
Whilst at the 2010 Diablo Valley Mustang Association "Show and Shine" this past Saturday I came across a white 1966 V8 convertible with the "black and white" themed interior similar to mine (sans the black and white gauges, the black and white center console, et al). Maybe it's time to source that rear seat upholstery and get these installed. The convertible also has the same door panels as I do.
Tuesday, May 4, 2010
All the parts that fit, we use, or adapt, or something.
A good friend of mine had a box of carburetors that I once had in my garage prior to deciding to rebuild the carburetor I had. I saw this box while visiting him the other day and found in it: one electric choke for a Holley carburetor. The bracket wouldn't fit (this I knew), but the choke wheel most certainly would. After a few minutes of fiddling with the Autolite hold-down screws + the new Holley choke (and running a 12v lead + ground to the choke area) voila, It's Electric. Goodbye old hot-air automatic choke.
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